Re: Now Playing

by BretBaber Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:29 pm

What I meant by the comment is that I love the simplicity of JRPG. WRPG offer too much for me to do, so much that they sometimes take away from the storyline. I was so convinced I would love Oblivion and Dragon's Age but could never grasp what I was doing in the games. For some they love tinkering with every aspect of the character and having loads to do. Ni No Kuni gave me 4 awesome characters (I'm including Mr. Drippy because he was awesome to have around), and a combat system that was deep, but not overwhelming. I want to like WRPG's, but I just can't. So what I meant was that Ni No Kuni finally delivered an RPG this gen that is everything I want and love, where as the others for me personally are just filler that I can't get into but want to. Even Final Fantasy games were a big let down to me this gen.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:08 am

I know it comes down to a matter of taste in many cases, but far too many fans of JRPGs dont give WRPGs a fair chance (and vice versa) A lot of people except them to be similiar and when they aren't they just automatically think its bad or too complicated or whatever. When they arent they just different. To be honest JRPGs tend to be far more complicated, and overwhelming in terms of gameplay, and story. WRPGs just give you more control over things.

I hated Mass Effect 2 the first time I played it. I was so mad bioware made it a shooter or whatever. A year later I bought it on the cheap, and now ive put over 300 hours into that game. It's my favorite RPG this gen, and the only game i really feel like I mastered this gen. It's to this gen what Persona 3/4 were to last. God I love that game so much, but if i wouldnt have given it a second chance.

I get preferences, but in most cases comparing JRPGs to WRPGs is just imo wrong. So many of them are so different, hell comparing Skyrim to Mass Effect is kind of pushing it too in my books. I guess my point is games should be judged on their own merits and not based on what genre they are or something. I think I'm making sense but its 3am i should probably fucking sleep.

by chocobot Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:59 am

I never compare WRPGs and JRPGs to each other either, they're so different they are like two separate genres. I like them both but for very different reasons. So I can understand having a preference or liking one and not the other, there's nothing wrong with that at all.

Anyway, you should tell me the name of that used game store you found, San Andreas. I don't live too horribly far from Tempe so maybe I could check it out sometime.

by BretBaber Sun Sep 15, 2013 11:51 pm

The simple fact is I don't find WRPG to be fun. I want to like them, but they offer so much customization it takes me out of the game. I like a story driven, semi-linear game with turn based combat. Those will always be my favorite role playing games. It's just my taste in games.

by ajapam Mon Sep 16, 2013 12:39 am

I like the story focus of JRPGs as well. Granted, some WRPGs do the same, but I find that the larger focus on customization can take away from the ability to tell a well-crafted story. The best story in a WRPG I can think of is in Mass Effect, and the latter 2 games weren't all that great in the story department. It got by with it's characters and universe.

Finished up Papers, Please today. My ending was kind of a punch to the gut. I think it's a bit overrated but I ran into a few interesting situations and one very amusing immigrant along the way. I'd recommend it to anyone who is interested, but I wouldn't try to convince anyone who wasn't already thinking about getting it.

I also restarted Amnesia. Just got through the cellar... *gulp*

by volvocrusher Mon Sep 16, 2013 12:52 am

Interesting. Customization getting in the way of a story to me sounds really foreign. Like saying shooting things or opening a menu gets in the way. Personally, it's my favorite part of RPGs. It's a large part of why Pokemon is my favorite turn based combat and Mass Effect 3 is my favorite shooting, the customization they offer just crushes the competition. To replay a game and have a different gameplay experience is just awesome to me, I prefer it so much to having a longer game.

Got Wonderful 101 today despite my massive backlog, amount of schoolwork, and just getting Splinter Cell for some reason. It's a blast though. Still trying to wrap my head around everything and managing nearly a hundred characters at once in an action game can get overwhelming, but it's still a really fun and unique game.

by ajapam Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:35 am

Well in WRPGs you get more freedom to do things your way. Your character, your story... It's harder to tell a focused story that way, and pretty much impossible to have a truly great main character as far as I'm concerned. Mass Effect did alright with it but Shephard was more of a personality than a fleshed out character

by volvocrusher Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:50 am

Oh, okay you mean that kind of customization. Was thinking more stat building and armor upgrades. I always fleshed out the main characters in my head actually. Even gets more in depth with each replay, my Shepard I'm playing as now has PTSD from Akuze every time she sees a Thresher Maw in ME1 and has an arc getting over it throughout the series....shit I do play these games a lot.

by BretBaber Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:51 am

I don't think it's a bad complaint. In Dragon Quest games I like to run around leveling up and gaining money to buy the newest equipment in the newest town. It's simple fun, and for me it is very addictive. In Oblivion, I absolutely hated the fact that my weapons would slowly break over time unless I fixed them. I hated having so many options when talking to someone. WRPG have so many awesome things going for them, but they're not for ME. I'm not saying they're not fun to others, but for me they are not.

Would I rather read a book (as in a traditional book) or would I rather read a Choose Your Own Adventure Book? They're both books, but I would always pick the traditional book over the Choose Your Own Adventure Book. Why? Because I always feel the book with one ending has the better ending.

It's not just WRPG I have for branching stories. I'm playing Chrono Cross now and I love a lot of things about the game, but I hate knowing I do not have a set story. Makes me not want to play it. If I can somehow mess up and get a bad ending, it takes the fun out of a game for me.

Also, it's not that I hate customization, I just hate it when there is so much of it. Do you know how much online shooters would suck if everyone used the same weapons? How boring would Final Fantasy VII be if every character had the same materia? Super sucky and really boring. I'm not opposed to customizing things, I just don't like when the bulk of a game is customizing.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:55 am

Honestly I prefer JRPGs for the style, and in many cases combat. I've always thought in general story driven WRPGs had better stories. I love a lot of JRPGs but FAR too many of them have crazy convoluted stories, and/or go off on tangents that literally go nowhere. Stuff like Mass Effect, and Jade Empire make it feel like everything you do within the main story is important to it. JRPGs in general don't do that. I've lost count of how many times JRPGs led me to believe that a certain part is the end of it, then BAM another enemy appears or whatever.

Or shit like this

In White Knight Chronicles 2:

Or

In Atelier Totori:

I love JRPGs, and the insane, stupid shit can be really entertaining if done right, but I think a lot of the writing REALLY lacks focus. I'd hesitate to call most of it "better" than in WRPGs. More entertaining, in many cases yeah it definitely can be, but i wouldnt call it better.

Honestly last gen I would have said JRPGs were waaaaaaaaaaaaaay better to me, but this gen I cant really say either way. After what Mass Effect did I can't really say I have a preference to JRPGs anymore. I play more of them sure, but stuff like Neptunia or Atelier really doesnt wow me or anything i just play them for fun. Its rare when stuff like Tales of Xillia or Ni No Kuni (yes I'll admit the game is amazing, but it's not for everyone) comes out

@Bret: Chrono Cross doesn't really have a bad ending as a matter of fact most people will get literally no ending the first time. You pretty much need to play it on NG+ to get any ending. Your choices don't affect it at all.

EDIT: or i should say your choices the first time around nothing you do in the first playthrough affects it. You can get a better ending if you do a certain thing at the final boss fight, and the game hints at that, but most endings are gotten through NG+ and fighting the end boss at other points in the story before the ending.

by BretBaber Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:09 am

I'm not going to get an ending!? That makes me want to stop playing right now. Whenever I play a game for a second time, I almost never choose the new game + option. Man, this is a real let down.

Oblivion seemed like it had a nice story, but after getting lost doing side quests and never being able to figure out how to level up, I quit playing the game. Dragon Age seemed pretty all right too, but when I was fighting I never felt like I was doing anything.

This gen just sucked for JRPG. Ni No Kuni was the only RPG that I liked this gen.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:13 am

You get a really simple one unless you fight the final boss a certain way.

Spoiler:

by volvocrusher Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:14 am

I get the genre's not for you Bret. And wasn't saying you're anti custimization either, I'm just more in the mindset where the more customization a game offers, the better. That's all.

But I don't think it's fair to compare a WRPG to a choose your own adventure book. Those books suck not because you're picking something, but because it's shifting between being interactive and non-interactive all the time. Games are interactive the whole way through and that's the difference between, "What should happen?" and "What should I do?" which makes all the difference. And though I still haven't played a WRPG with an amazing ending, making tough choices is just something you can't get out of a linear story. I don't want every game to have a story that way, in fact I'm glad (TLOU spoiler)

Spoiler:

. But interactive stories definitely do have a place in games that no other medium can provide.

Also Dragon Age 2 fixed your complaint about combat (though had many more problems) and 3 looks to keep it that way while keeping what made 1 awesome and then some. If you're still interested in an RPG in that world, it may give you what you want. Plus may be the PS4's first big RPG.

by ajapam Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:46 am

I know a lot JRPGs have terribly written storylines, but they still have a lot of untapped potential. WRPGs tend to be written better but the subject matter is often pretty standard apart from little sidemissions. The style, structure, and even combat in JRPGs lets you do things would feel out of place otherwise. Of course, I think a lot more is possible in both genre once they start borrowing from eachother (not that I'm saying there isn't a place for a traditional game on either side.)

For example, the unusual story of Persona 4 or the cheery innocence of Ni No Kuni are rarely seen in a WRPG. A lot of it is just the style of the games, but the combat also keeps the player at an arms length from real violence. This lets the game tackle different themes without the issue of ludonarrative dissonance (Sorry, Trip! It normally doesn't matter but I'm talking about serious stories here, so I think it does.) Even if a JRPG tackled the same subjects as a WRPG, the more linear storyline and less customizable character could create an extremely interesting experience

by Krubixcube Mon Sep 16, 2013 7:52 am

I think JRPGs just need to work on combining their narrative and combat elements in little subtle ways. Spells that can be used outside of battle, certain characters giving bonuses (like a revealed map or something) because of hteir backstory. The possibilities are endless.

by BretBaber Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:14 am

Yeah, why didn't anyone just phoenix down Aeris? Bunch of punks.

I'd like to try Dragon Age 1 again, but the game takes up too much hard drive space. 8 GB!? I hate when games do that. I need a new hard drive in the worst way.

by Rainjar Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:23 pm

I don't know where the fuck to post this so I'm going to leave it here.

by TripOpt55 Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:10 pm

Bret your harddrive dictates what you play too often... haha. You really need to solve that problem. I can't count how many times you've said, "Well I was going to play it, but the file/install size is so big."

by BretBaber Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:16 pm

It happens all the damn time! When switching around my Playstation case today I looked at the back of Dragon Age and noticed it is actually 3 GB. I wonder why I always thought it was 8. I need to platinum Borderlands so I can delete that, that's 7 GB on there. Also should delete one of the Call of Duty games because it has around 7 or 8 GB as well.

What I don't understand is how I'm the only one this happens to. What size do you have Trip? I thought you bought your second PS3 when the slim model was introduced, the same time as me. So I'm guessing you have 120 GB which actually turns out to be only 90 or so. That's bull shit how that always happens.

by TripOpt55 Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:28 pm

I have a 320 GB I think. I did fill it up recently after about 3 years, but there is always plenty of installs I can delete to make room. I figure I can always re-install them. It doesn't get rid of your save or anything. PS+ full games put a hurting on an HDD though that is for sure. I don't mind getting rid of them if I don't think I'll play them soon though.

Also when I had my 60 GB, HDD space was a nightmare... haha.

by BretBaber Tue Sep 17, 2013 1:12 am

I really don't have too many things on there that I don't play often. There's some I have on there that I don't plan on playing soon, but plan on playing again and i just want to avoid the whole install. I usually only have one big free PS+ game on there at a time. Right now that big game is Saints Row 3. Surprisingly I never fill up my 16GB iPhone or 32GB iPod touch.

by lenny.b Tue Sep 17, 2013 3:52 am

Rainjar wrote:I don't know where the fuck to post this so I'm going to leave it here.

Cracked me up. I detest most DLCs.

by lenny.b Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:03 am

BretBaber wrote:I'm not going to get an ending!? That makes me want to stop playing right now. Whenever I play a game for a second time, I almost never choose the new game + option. Man, this is a real let down.

Oblivion seemed like it had a nice story, but after getting lost doing side quests and never being able to figure out how to level up, I quit playing the game. Dragon Age seemed pretty all right too, but when I was fighting I never felt like I was doing anything.

This gen just sucked for JRPG. Ni No Kuni was the only RPG that I liked this gen.

I thought it was possible to get that same ending without a NG+ play-through. But I forget, is it not possible to get the Chrono Cross without NG+? That sounds odd to me. Anyway, I really enjoyed Chrono Cross, but nothing will ever beat my love and fandom for Chrono Trigger.

by lenny.b Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:19 am

Krubixcube wrote:@lenny 何となくします、漢字はちょっと難しいけどね

@Krubixcube その通りだけどゲームは日本語で理解出来ればよかったね。

by Miraculous Kaydybug Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:52 am

lenny.b wrote:
BretBaber wrote:I'm not going to get an ending!? That makes me want to stop playing right now. Whenever I play a game for a second time, I almost never choose the new game + option. Man, this is a real let down.

Oblivion seemed like it had a nice story, but after getting lost doing side quests and never being able to figure out how to level up, I quit playing the game. Dragon Age seemed pretty all right too, but when I was fighting I never felt like I was doing anything.

This gen just sucked for JRPG. Ni No Kuni was the only RPG that I liked this gen.
I thought it was possible to get that same ending without a NG+ play-through. But I forget, is it not possible to get the Chrono Cross without NG+? That sounds odd to me. Anyway, I really enjoyed Chrono Cross, but nothing will ever beat my love and fandom for Chrono Trigger.

The Chrono Cross ending, and the standard ending you can get without NG+ just not any of the others.

I'm nearing the end of Killer is Dead and honestly its a bit of a let down. It's definitely got Suda's style and it has its moments but theres literally no substance at all. My feelings on this game are summed up by my feelings about Episode 10 it starts out as HOLY SHIT THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER, but they when the mission actually starts and youre playing its completly meh. It's sad too cause it reminds me a lot of some of my favorite games. Alice Madness Returns, Nocturne, No More Heroes, but it just falls flat in so many areas. It should be mind blowingly amazing but its not even close.

by Krubixcube Tue Sep 17, 2013 5:28 am

@Lenny: 大体分かります、でもバトル・システムなどの言葉とかは時々無理だ。

as for the harddrive stuff...if I could rebuild my computer I would have 2 TB hard drives, I would partition one of them and keep windows/low load programs on it. On another partition I would keep all my music and shit like htat. On the third would be all my games/heavy load programs. IF ONLY. Too much work to do it now. The next time I upgrade though, things'll be different.

Just reinstalled Mass Effect. Been watching my girlfriend replay it (and 2) and I just felt the urge to completely copy her. Still need to work on Witcher 2 (among other games) as well...but hey, my backlog is +2 this year (as in I beat 2 more games than I bought) so...go me?

by chocobot Tue Sep 17, 2013 6:01 am

Kayshire Cat wrote:
I'm nearing the end of Killer is Dead and honestly its a bit of a let down. It's definitely got Suda's style and it has its moments but theres literally no substance at all. My feelings on this game are summed up by my feelings about Episode 10 it starts out as HOLY SHIT THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER, but they when the mission actually starts and youre playing its completly meh. It's sad too cause it reminds me a lot of some of my favorite games. Alice Madness Returns, Nocturne, No More Heroes, but it just falls flat in so many areas. It should be mind blowingly amazing but its not even close.[/color]

Damn, that's really disappointing. Looked like it would be an awesome game.

by SanAndreasX Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:07 pm

Wow, gone a few days and the board goes nuts! So here is my shotgun approach to the board....

@chocobot: The game store I mentioned is Fallout Games. It's in the southeast corner of the intersection at McClintock Drive and Southern Avenue. It had some very obscure old systems, lots of imports, and lots of rare goodies. If I didn't absolutely have to get home before the weekend, I'd have spent all day in there. Man, I miss living in Arizona.

On the JRPG/WRPG debate: It's no secret I prefer the former. I like the style, gameplay, and yes, the bizarre stories, better. I do like some WRPGs, however. My gold standard for WRPGs is the Ultima series, which is what I played a lot when I was a teenager before EA's meddling killed the series. To that end, I prefer Bethesda's approach to the genre over Bioware's. Bioware's games look cool enough but I've never been able to really get into any of them. Bethesda just does what I liked about WRPGs before a lot better (just wandering about and causing trouble). I will say, however, that I strongly prefer Fallout 3 and New Vegas over Elder Scrolls games. I like Fallout for the post-apocalyptic settings. With Elder Scrolls, I'm not a huge fan of Tolkienesque humans/elf/dwarf fantasy. I like my fantasy more of the steampunk/anime variety. So JRPGs FTW again. Smile

by SanAndreasX Tue Sep 17, 2013 12:11 pm

On another note, is anyone getting GTA V? I see the critics have been rubber-stamping 10s all over it like they always do with GTA. I just thought GTA IV was one of the dullest games I ever played, and while I like the idea of a Los Angeles setting, I hope they've fixed the controls and shooting in GTA V and made it a lot more playable. If they have, I might get it. If not, maybe when it's $20 in the bargain bin.

by ajapam Tue Sep 17, 2013 1:01 pm

From what I've heard, the driving is actually fun. The on foot controls sound like they're better but still a bit clunky.

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