Re: Anticipated Games

by Krubixcube Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:33 pm

I just hope Kojima doesn't try to explain EVERYTHING like he did in 4. The villains in MGS1 and 3 were cool because they didn't really have an explanation as to why they were magical they just were.

It's like Children of Men...ANY explanation they could give for why people stopped having children would have been stupid but they left it and just let it play out and you accepted it. So Kojima...I love your mysterious ass trailers, please keep your game with just a fraction of that ambiguity

by Captain N Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:22 am

Krubixcube wrote:The only thing that bugs me...and YES this is just me being old person...but the fact that Kojima's show of the FOX Engine at GDC was obsessed with realism. "LOOK...IT'S SO REAL!". Which...I don't know, it is very real but now we're getting to the point where does realism = better? It's very impressive tech to be sure but I don't know. Something about it bugged me.

I know once we get to Pixar graphic quality in games during the actual gameplay and not the cgi, then that's when I know gaming has come far in terms of visuals.

by volvocrusher Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:26 am

Captain N wrote:
Krubixcube wrote:The only thing that bugs me...and YES this is just me being old person...but the fact that Kojima's show of the FOX Engine at GDC was obsessed with realism. "LOOK...IT'S SO REAL!". Which...I don't know, it is very real but now we're getting to the point where does realism = better? It's very impressive tech to be sure but I don't know. Something about it bugged me.
I know once we get to Pixar graphic quality in games during the actual gameplay and not the cgi, then that's when I know gaming has come far in terms of visuals.

Anticipated Games - Page 6 Ratchet-clank-future-a-crack-in-time-5

Been there, done that.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:45 am

Also this

Anticipated Games - Page 6 Atelier-ayesha-cutest-ever-010

Honestly I don't think graphics can get any better. I wasn't really wowed by the MGSV trailer to be honest at least in terms of anything beyond it being MGSV. The hyper-realistic stuff doesnt really make it better imo, but if this new engine can have better AI, stuff like that then yeah its great, but as far as graphics go nothing really impresses me anymore.

by Krubixcube Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:13 am

Yeah, and in my opinion, hyper real graphics with the same level of AI I'm seeing in games now would actually make a game worse not better. It's fine when a more cartoony character runs in circles or gets stuck on a wall but when a photorealistic model starts running in circles or glitches out it breaks immersion more than usual.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:48 am

I never really thought but that but yeah you are right, and especially if they do stuff like get caught in walls where half their body is going through it with badly animated models it just kind of seems normal but when they look like they are from a live action movie not so much, but I'd also go as far as to say it can have the same effect in like cel-shading thats really detailed as well. As much as I like Atelier Totori+ there's sometimes when Totori's legs kind of go through the bottom of the dlc costume i have for and it kind of irks me everytime I see it. It's like the model looks really great and then this just kind of ruins it a little.

by ajapam Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:55 am

Unscripted AI movement is still pretty bad sometimes. Even when it's not glitchy, enemies move around in totally unnatural ways. I guess they could improve that. Honestly, next gen graphics are noticeably better... In the same way that Uncharted 2 looks noticeably better than Drake's Fortune (and I'm being pretty generous with that comparison)

by Nephilimi Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:05 am

Of all the ridiculous complaints...

by Krubixcube Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:07 am

We're just discussing things, you're just being grumpy.

by Nephilimi Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:17 am

Just let yourself go. Relax and enjoy the next gen hype.

Yes, the important things games need to work on is story or AI or gameplay and fancy graphics are no substitute.

Yes the more realistic the graphics get then the more you notice problems.

But just enjoy it. MGS and BF4 looked unfuckingbelievable. They gave me goosebumps. I didn't think graphics could get that much better. Ten years ago after watching trailers for FF7 were you sitting with your thumb up your ass whining about how good the graphics looked? No. You were just excited. I swear to god cynicism is going to be the end of gaming.

by volvocrusher Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:27 am

The reason people are less excited about graphics is because ten years ago the best game ever made came out and it looked like this
Anticipated Games - Page 6 Knights-of-the-old-republic

Anticipated Games - Page 6 Knights-of-the-old-republic

Now that same company is making games that look like this
Anticipated Games - Page 6 Masseffect3palaven1

There's room for improvement, but a lot less need for it. I'd personally be fine if graphics technology stayed around this point, even after seeing Battlefield 4 and Killzone 4.

by Krubixcube Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:40 am

Nephilimi wrote:I swear to god cynicism is going to be the end of gaming.

Says "I wont buy a game because they included multiplayer in it" man.

by TripOpt55 Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:17 am

Nephilimi wrote:Just let yourself go. Relax and enjoy the next gen hype.

Yes, the important things games need to work on is story or AI or gameplay and fancy graphics are no substitute.

Yes the more realistic the graphics get then the more you notice problems.

But just enjoy it. MGS and BF4 looked unfuckingbelievable. They gave me goosebumps. I didn't think graphics could get that much better. Ten years ago after watching trailers for FF7 were you sitting with your thumb up your ass whining about how good the graphics looked? No. You were just excited. I swear to god cynicism is going to be the end of gaming.

The bolded coming from you seems ridiculous, but I am with you on the other stuff. Sure their is stuff I'd rather they work on, but I'm not going to complain about getting some better graphics. And for those not impressed with the jump so far, I think they will come around. These games we are seeing are so early on this new hardware. Think about the jump between launch PS3 titles and stuff like The Last of Us. A few years in is going to be really great.

by Bannen Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:26 am

Krubixcube wrote:
Nephilimi wrote:I swear to god cynicism is going to be the end of gaming.

Says "I wont buy a game because they included multiplayer in it" man.

Anticipated Games - Page 6 Boom_zpsae32bd3c

Fun on my terms, grumble grumble grumble...

by Nephilimi Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:31 am

I realize the obvious irony of my comment because I'm always bitching but I would like to think complaining about tacked on mp is a little more legitimate than whining about graphics being too good.

Graphics are passed the point of diminishing returns. Certainly in terms of functionality graphics have peaked. But that doesn't mean you can't still get excited about a great looking game. When something like MGS5 or BF4 drops and people are not only unimpressed but actually complaining about the graphics being better... doesn't that seem really, really depressing.

And it's not like every game is shooting for great graphics and things are getting lost. There's no shortage of rinky dink indy titles on Steam and PSN and Live chasing that Journey dream, trying to make games with shit graphics. Not to mention all the cell shaded efforts. There's only a handful of big triple A titles still trying to wow you with improvement and technical graphics. MGS has always been one of those games. It has always pushed the technology available. How is MGS5 any different or how will it suffer from that emphasis on graphics when it has always emphasized graphics?

by b.b.hagen Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:16 pm

I thought the graphics in the MGS5 trailer looked pretty fucking incredible. Especially the faces.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:04 pm

I prefer cel-shading tbh. If anyone asks me what game has the best graphics this gen I'd instantly say Atelier Ayesha. Say what you will about the game but looking at it just like staring into this candy colored euphoric dream thats just great.

by Krubixcube Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:01 am

I wasn't whining at all...it looks amazing! But it's harder to get immersed in a game when you have weird shit happening with amazing graphics. Happened with me in Crysis quite a bit.

It's just a discussion on uncanny valley...I think you don't realize something about me Neph: just because I bring up a point about something doesn't mean I don't love it or find it impressive. No need to go off on one for me complaining.

I did get annoyed with the WAY they presented their engine, except when they actually started showing cool stuff like changing the lighting without hurt to graphics quality etc. I was just getting annoyed with the "LOOK, IT IS A PHOTO, LOOK IT IS A GRAPHICS!"

by Captain N Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:46 pm

I'm with Kay, Cel-Shaded graphics are my favorite kind of graphics for a game. Mostly because of Windwaker, but games with that artstyle just look so good. Windwaker may be a Gamecube game but it's artstyle still hold up well even for today's standards. Not only that, but the gameplay as well. I'm just glad one of my wishes came true with WWHD, everyday, I look at my calender to see if it's August yet.

by TripOpt55 Sat Mar 30, 2013 7:24 pm

I'm very curious about this Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon game. Seems like an Undead Nightmare/Festival of Blood type thing.

by Nephilimi Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:56 pm

Screw cell shaded. I've always been a graphics whore and I love to see what the new systems have to offer. Graphics excite me more than even gameplay. Cell shaded is a lazy excuse that's overused. It can work really well if it's applied properly but in games like Dishonored it just looks stupid and ruins the tone.

by Krubixcube Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:27 am

Sounds like someone is complaining =p

by ajapam Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:49 am

Cel-shaded is even lazier than brown/grey blandness at times. Some games (Wind Waker) do it well because they have good visual design to go along with it

by volvocrusher Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:09 am

ajapam wrote:Cel-shaded is even lazier than brown/grey blandness at times. Some games (Wind Waker) do it well because they have good visual design to go along with it

Borderlands was when I realized that cel-shading can be boring as fuck. Felt like Gearbox saw they had an ugly game so they added it at the last second so it would pop out.

by TripOpt55 Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:18 am

Well obviously I enjoy both realistic and cel-shaded stuff. I like seeing stuff pushed on a technical level and in new different artistic directions. Like Uncharted and that PoP 08 game would be amongst my favorite games graphically this gen. Both styles can also be boring though. And I'd like to point out that even with a cartoony artstyle developers can push things technically. Not with cel-shading necessarily, but something like the Ratchet Future games I feel were pretty technically impressive. I'm sure it could be pushed further by the right developer.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Sun Mar 31, 2013 2:52 am

volvocrusher wrote:
ajapam wrote:Cel-shaded is even lazier than brown/grey blandness at times. Some games (Wind Waker) do it well because they have good visual design to go along with it
Borderlands was when I realized that cel-shading can be boring as fuck. Felt like Gearbox saw they had an ugly game so they added it at the last second so it would pop out.

Cel-Shading works great when it adds to the games artsyle or atmosphere. Wind Waker, No More Heroes, DQ8, Rogue Galaxy, Tales games, and the Atelier games do this well, but I will agree some games don't it just works with how well the source material melds with it. Same goes for hyper-realism.

by Krubixcube Sun Mar 31, 2013 2:58 am

I think good art direction is good art direction regardless of what style is used. I don't care if it's realistic or cel-shaded or 2D or whatever, it will stand the test of time if the art direction is good.

Simple as that.

by Miraculous Kaydybug Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:44 am

Agreed. If think a game has bad art direction I usually end up hating it. It's one of the reason I'll never be able to get into military shooters they look so bland.

by SanAndreasX Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:45 am

Cel-shading in the right hands looks incredible. I spend a lot of time in Ni no Kuni just running around and looking at the scenery, it's that amazing. Level-5, incidentally, is the same company that made one of the best-looiking PS2 games ever made, Dragon Quest VIII. That game still looks great today. Ditto with Okami. Valkyria Chronicles will likewise still look awesome a long time from now. Cel-shading doesn't show its age as rapidly as whatever passes for photorealism in any given generation.

Not every game needs to be cel-shaded. Call of Duty, MGS, and Resident Evil don't need to be cel-shaded, because it doesn't fit their subject matter. But by that same token, realistic browns and greens would have been entirely the wrong choice for Ni no Kuni.

by TripOpt55 Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:45 pm

Puppeteer will be releasing on September 10th at the price of $39.99 (I love that Sony is selling games at varying prices now). Here are a couple of new videos. I think this looks like a fun game.

Ninja Gameplay

Knight Gameplay

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